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Treetop
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« on: September 01, 2010, 08:31:30 AM »

How is the LSAT percentile score computed? Does it depend on how many people take the exam each time?
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LSAT Eliminator
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« Reply #1 on: September 01, 2010, 09:04:08 AM »

No, it's actually based on the three prior years worth of test results. That way it is based on a sizable enough to be a stable sample, and the variances from one test to another aren't very noticeable. From year to year you see small changes, but you won't see a say, 2% percentile change in a score from one year to the next. 

The number of people taking any individual exam is irrelevant, as are the scores they receive (because they already know how the vast majority will score based on using the results of the experimental sections over the years).
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Col. Sanders
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« Reply #2 on: September 01, 2010, 09:50:47 AM »

The percentile doesn't really mean much; right? Isn't the actual score the only thing that really matters?
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« Reply #3 on: September 01, 2010, 10:01:16 AM »

The percentile is especially useful to law schools because it gives them a sense of what each score actually means. 173 would just be a random number on a scale, but when you know it means the 99th percentile, it changes the meaning quite a bit.
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Anne
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« Reply #4 on: September 01, 2010, 11:58:20 AM »

You could even say that the percentile might be even more important than the score itself in certain cases, particularly in cases when test itself was especially brutal. Don't you think so, Eliminator?
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Treetop
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« Reply #5 on: September 01, 2010, 12:11:54 PM »

You could even say that the percentile might be even more important than the score itself in certain cases, particularly in cases when test itself was especially brutal. Don't you think so, Eliminator?

Not if it's based on the three prior years worth of test results...right? Or am I still not getting this?  Confused
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« Reply #6 on: September 01, 2010, 12:56:10 PM »

You have to remember that even particularly brutal tests should have the same score results as other exams, mainly because they will adjust the scoring scale so that you can miss more quesitons and still get the same LSAT score you would on an "easy" test.

That scoring scale adjustment is why admissions people can ignore which test you took and just focus on your score/percentile.
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Anne
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« Reply #7 on: September 01, 2010, 01:26:40 PM »

You have to remember that even particularly brutal tests should have the same score results as other exams, mainly because they will adjust the scoring scale so that you can miss more quesitons and still get the same LSAT score you would on an "easy" test.

That scoring scale adjustment is why admissions people can ignore which test you took and just focus on your score/percentile.

Ah, of course! Duh, that makes sense. Head Hammer See, this is why Eliminator reigns supreme when it comes to all things LSAT. Smiley
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« Reply #8 on: September 01, 2010, 01:52:58 PM »

It's true, I am Supreme

 Sunshine!
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Jeffort
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« Reply #9 on: September 01, 2010, 06:42:46 PM »

It's true, I am Supreme

 Sunshine!

Nice, but you clicked on the wrong smiley!  These are the 'I am super supreme' ones:   Woot!   Headbang  

And yes, as eliminator said in other words the percentile rank chart is a compilation of the historical data of all achieved scores from the previous 3 years of administered LSAT's (meaning every test taken that the taker did not cancel, hence received a reported score for).  LSAC simply puts all that data together and calculates for each scaled score the percentage of test takers in the 3 year pool that scored below it.  

For simple illustration, if there were 1000 people that took the LSAT in the last 3 years that received a reported score (didn't cancel), and in that group only 1 person out of the 1000 scored a 180, the corresponding percentile rank for it would be the 99.9th percentile.  It's just basic math they use to calculate the comparative performance rank of each scaled score within the pool of test takers.  Take the group size = 1000, add up the # of people that scored below each 120-180 score (999 below 180 in the example numbers), then divide that number by total group size.  999 divided by 1000 = 99.9 percent of test scores in the pool were below 180.  

If out of the hypothetical 1000, 500 of the reported scores were below 150, then the percentile rank for a 150 would be the 50th percentile.

Since people are used to grading systems where a forced percentile curve is applied to individual groups of test takers when assigning grades (meaning that no matter how well everyone does on a test that the grades must be distributed so that only a pre-determined percentage of students in the group/class receives an A, B, C, D, etc.), many people incorrectly think that the percentile rank/distribution of achieved LSAT scores is a forced curve and that the score conversion chart for each test is intended and adjusted to insure forced maintenance of the bell curve for each group of test takers per administration.  

It is not, which is why the percentile rank of each scaled score fluctuates slightly every time they re-calculate and publish the percentile rank chart.  The minor annual fluctuations in the percentile ranking chart are due to the varying preparation and skill levels of the pools of people that took the test in the last 3 years.  

The percentile ranks do not necessarily hold true per administration when looked at individually rather than looking at the 3 year pool.  The distribution of scores for any particular administration can be significantly different than the combined 3 year stats.

Another way to put it for illustration is that if for a few years unprepared people that wouldn't be able to understand what a contrapositive is for the life of them made up the overwhelming majority of test takers, a 150 could end up being a 90th percentile or higher score.  

Theoretically, if most test takers became one of the Supremes like Eliminator and kicked major arse on the test getting near perfect raw point scores for a few years a 170 could end up having a 50.1 percentile rank if only 501 of the 1000 scored below 170.  The percentiles that form the statistical bell curve are the natural byproduct of the LSAT performance/ability/skill levels of the population of people that took the test in the last 3 years.  In a perfect world if everyone that took a particular LSAT got all or very very close to all the questions correct LSAC would give them all high 170's/180's.

The test development process relies on super crazy psychometric math and pre-testing/measuring the comparative difficulty level of each test item.  The development and assembly of test forms process is designed to insure as best as possible that no matter which administration you take, whether it is a harder or easier version of the test, and that no matter how well prepared or not well prepared each group of test takers is, each achieved scaled score represents the same performance/skill /ability level with the particular things the LSAT is designed to measure that Law Schools think are important to doing well in LS.  

Since it is a standardized test and LSAC has no control over who decides to take the test nor over how well they prep, LSAT scores must be able to be reliably compared across test forms.  That is the essence of a standardized test and means that no matter the relative skill level and performance of each group of test takers, a 170 or whatever score will always represent the same skill/performance/proficiency level with the pre-defined skills being tested, kinda like a measuring tape or a ruler is a standardized tool for measuring length.  No matter what/who you measure with it and when, 12 inches always measures as and is reported as 12 inches.  

I can go into additional detail if anyone wants to dork out more about LSAT design and psychometrics.   bandit

Hopefully the above is enough for me to qualify to be allowed to join the new Supremes band and sing duets with Eliminator!   Hyper

The Supremes Baby Love



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LSAT Eliminator
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« Reply #10 on: September 03, 2010, 11:57:32 AM »

I don't like those two smileys! I like my sun one better.

Anyway, I should retract that statement that I am supreme. It makes me feel like a Taco Bell product.
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Wintermute
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« Reply #11 on: September 03, 2010, 01:16:16 PM »


 Sunshine!

I'm a sun king, baby.

The Cult Sun King
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Anne
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« Reply #12 on: September 03, 2010, 01:23:48 PM »

I don't like those two smileys! I like my sun one better.

Anyway, I should retract that statement that I am supreme. It makes me feel like a Taco Bell product.

LOL.

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Check out my Law School Admissions Tip of the Week on the PowerScore LSAT and Law School Admissions Blog: http://blog.powerscore.com/lsat
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« Reply #13 on: September 03, 2010, 09:27:37 PM »

Cool song, Wintermute!


Anne, exactly: now I'm just a burrito supreme! Hence my retraction.

 Sunshine!
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Jeffort
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« Reply #14 on: September 03, 2010, 11:17:24 PM »

Cool song, Wintermute!


Anne, exactly: now I'm just a burrito supreme! Hence my retraction.

 Sunshine!

Well, I tried to get us to create a male version of the musical Supremes group but somehow you ended up going with being a burrito Supreme instead...  Hm?  Although, being a burrito Supreme couldn't be all that bad since people like em and sing about them.

Tenacious D LIVE 2008 - Burrito Supreme




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